Content Licensing

CyanWorlds.com Engine Project Management
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JWPlatt
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Re: Content Licensing

Post by JWPlatt » Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:13 pm

Personally, I would not share what amounts to speculation on such an important and sometimes contentious issue. It could prematurely raise expectations, or misrepresent as promise, where there should be none to levels to which Cyan has not agreed. That's not fair. If something doesn't pan out, it wrongly lays blame on Cyan for not agreeing to what amounts to our own fantasy, not what they proposed; something they might not have represented in the first place. But what Mac has already written, and the content of the Community Request, is really representative of the information in its entirety.

Further, and frankly, if my posts create this kind of response, I am not inclined to post further in any form until there is an announcement of the actual license from Cyan Worlds. I have been asked for updates and I give what I can despite sometimes my better judgement. I hope that's clear enough.
Perfect speed is being there.

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Hoikas
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Re: Content Licensing

Post by Hoikas » Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:15 pm

Everybody here knows there are no promises. Given that they (Cyan) spent millions of dollars and many man hours over many years creating said content, I do not hold them accountable for anything that they have not said. You make it sound as if Deledrius is asking for something obscenely impossible or is being overly abrasive. Yet, all I see are requests for openness, which is what we've been asking for since the beginning. I also seem to remember a certain post...
JWPlatt wrote:I'd like an informed community. It's a matter of trust.
... I guess double standards are the norm. I also assume this means I can no longer trust you.
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Leonardo
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Re: Content Licensing

Post by Leonardo » Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:30 pm

I really shouldn't post and cause drama....but I feel I should say something.

I was under the impression that this content licencing thing was a dialog between the Community and Cyan, with OpenUru helping with communication. Not a dialog between Open Uru and Cyan, with the community watching it thru this thread. I was under the impression this was not the stage of the show, but an open backstage.
Shouldn't the communication be agreed with who is here discussing?
We have had already too many episodes of useless results (wrong licence, undistributable client, files with no usage licence...) because the community didn't have the opportunity to state what it really needed; this one should be handled more openly.

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JWPlatt
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Re: Content Licensing

Post by JWPlatt » Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:35 pm

Leonardo wrote:I was under the impression that this content licencing thing was a dialog between the Community and Cyan...
This is precisely what I'm talking about. Yes, that was the Community Request. Cyan has not responded yet about a dialog, but there is already blame based solely upon our request being misrepresented as a promise from Cyan.
Perfect speed is being there.

Leonardo
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Re: Content Licensing

Post by Leonardo » Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:39 pm

JWPlatt wrote:but there is already blame based solely on our request being represented as a promise from Cyan.
ah so your point is "there is no open dialog yet, but we're all thinking that there is because we asked for it"? So, since there is no open dialog OpenUru drops in and becomes the leader of the Content Licencing proposal?

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Hoikas
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Re: Content Licensing

Post by Hoikas » Tue Jul 03, 2012 8:42 pm

I like how my post was totally ignored... I guess it was too inconvenient to respond to, so instead, let's make a vague assertion and not back it up with any hard evidence.
JWPlatt wrote:Cyan has not responded yet about a dialog
And yet here you are having a dialog with them... Hmmmm.......... I don't know how to interpret THAT, especially when the elements of discussion come from the community proposal. :roll:

Forgive me when I think you're just whine-trolling.
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Nalates
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Re: Content Licensing

Post by Nalates » Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:10 pm

Steam has a new thing with their Machinima Tool, which is now being given away free. BUT... they too want to reserve rights on their content. You may find it intersting to review what they have done and point Cyan in that direction for ideas. People are often more comfortable when they can see how things are working, or not, rather than having to break ground.
Q. Can I make money with this tool?

Yes, but not if you’re using Valve’s assets in your movie. The tool is free for non-commercial use. You can use Valve’s game assets (things like characters, props, particles, textures, and sounds) to create movies and images to share with the game community, as long as what you create is free. We’re not giving you a license to commercialize our assets. However, if you do not include any of Valve’s assets in the movies and images that you make, then there are no restrictions on what you do with your content and you can make money with it.
See: http://www.sourcefilmmaker.com/faq/
Nalates
GoW, GoMa and GoA apprentice - Guildmaster GoC - SL = Nalates Urriah

Deledrius
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Re: Content Licensing

Post by Deledrius » Tue Jul 03, 2012 9:14 pm

Nalates wrote:Steam has a new thing with their Machinima Tool, which is now being given away free. BUT... they too want to reserve rights on their content. You may find it intersting to review what they have done and point Cyan in that direction for ideas. People are often more comfortable when they can see how things are working, or not, rather than having to break ground.
I agree. Looking at the example of how some successful companies like Valve have addressed this is a very wise idea.

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JWPlatt
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Re: Content Licensing

Post by JWPlatt » Tue Jul 03, 2012 10:59 pm

Will do. Like, immediately. Verbatim.
Leonardo wrote:
JWPlatt wrote:but there is already blame based solely on our request being represented as a promise from Cyan.
ah so your point is "there is no open dialog yet, but we're all thinking that there is because we asked for it"? So, since there is no open dialog OpenUru drops in and becomes the leader of the Content Licencing proposal?
Right. Anyone in the community may do as they wish and discuss content licensing, but until Cyan considers and accepts your request for a community dialog, which could simply be when they have time for for either, they choose their channel. And we'll take constructive suggestions such as Nalates and Deledrius's and do something about it. If anyone can do it better, they are welcome to try. We don't have a monopoly on trying. We'll be happy to either successfully help establish a license for you to enjoy, or simply enjoy another's success with you. When we have something to offer you that Cyan can represent as something it is willing to put forward for your consideration, we will.
Perfect speed is being there.

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branan
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Re: Content Licensing

Post by branan » Wed Jul 04, 2012 6:38 pm

JWPlatt wrote:When we have something to offer you that Cyan can represent as something it is willing to put forward for your consideration, we will.
Wrong answer.

The whole point of us going through OU for any of this was that we believed you were members of the community who had Cyan's ear and who could act as our representatives. We need somebody who will push back against Cyan when they're being stupid; who will be a single point of contact for them and share that communication with the rest of us; who will work with the rest of the community to make sure what they're discussing is still useful as it evolves.

Instead, it is increasingly clear that you see yourself as Cyan's representative to us. You have refused to share what you send to Cyan, and have refused to engage the rest of the fans in the actual dialog you're having with them. If that is indeed how you see yourself, you're useless - we can be stonewalled by Cyan quite directly, thank you very much.

I firmly believe that the goals of a Cyan business partner and the goals of a community leader are at this time incompatible, and that it is unethical for you to maintain your leadership position at a community organization with such a conflict of interest. If you intend to continue functioning as a business partner rather than a community member, I hereby request that you step down from all management and administrative duties at OpenURU or make it clear that OU functions as a business interest and not as a community organization as you have previously claimed.
Last edited by branan on Thu Jul 05, 2012 3:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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